Chaucer Ward Police priority!! Leaflets

No. Sorry.

What's true is that the NYC mayor trumpeted the policy of dealing with broken windows, as you say. Also true is that, according to SOME metrics, there was a reduction in SOME types of crime in the time following that.

What's far from proven is that there is any relationship between these two things. Either Malcolm Gladwell or Steven Levitt - can't remember which one - is one well-known commentator who eloquently refutes any link between them, if you're looking for more info.

I believe that studies have shown that dealing with low level crime reduces crime, ie if there is dropped litter in an area people are more likely to then grafitti that area.

However, I think much of the work of the community teams is about reducing the fear of crime, and cards in phone boxes makes an area feel less safe (and could encourage more crime if it's percieved as an area where crime will go unchallenged).

Ivanhoe wrote:

No. Sorry.
What's true is that the NYC mayor trumpeted the policy of dealing with broken windows, as you say. Also true is that, according to SOME metrics, there was a reduction in SOME types of crime in the time following that.

What's far from proven is that there is any relationship between these two things. Either Malcolm Gladwell or Steven Levitt - can't remember which one - is one well-known commentator who eloquently refutes any link between them, if you're looking for more info.

So whats the solution then?

There is usually a strong connection between prostitution and drug related activity, with other crimes resulting from it, which we should not underestimate.

jonnyp42 wrote:

Ivanhoe wrote:

No. Sorry.
What's true is that the NYC mayor trumpeted the policy of dealing with broken windows, as you say. Also true is that, according to SOME metrics, there was a reduction in SOME types of crime in the time following that.

What's far from proven is that there is any relationship between these two things. Either Malcolm Gladwell or Steven Levitt - can't remember which one - is one well-known commentator who eloquently refutes any link between them, if you're looking for more info.

So whats the solution then?

To what? I'm not claiming to have any solutions to anything. I'm just saying that there's no cause and effect relationship where you're claiming that there is one.

If pressed, I'd say that the solution to police officers wasting time doing undercover surveillance on phone boxes, if that's what we're looking for, probably lies in giving someone at the police station the common sense to resist "community" suggestions when they so clearly only represent the views of a vocal minority.

I'd challenge most people on here to name the location of their nearest (or any nearby) phone box.

I'd then ask then when was the last time they used it.

I'd be amazed if more than 10% have a clear idea of where their nearest phone box is, and if 10% of those have used a phone box within the last three months.

If carding in the unused, nonexistent, phone boxes is a problem for a significant number of people in SE1, then they're living in a different SE1 to me.

SmartAlec wrote:

There is usually a strong connection between prostitution and drug related activity, with other crimes resulting from it, which we should not underestimate.

But it is not as if cards in phone boxes cause either drug related activity or prostitution. Surely the solution is for BT to install card holders in their phone boxes and charge for the placement of cards there. Then it wont be a crime and BT get income they could use to employ people to tidy up their phone boxes.

If the oldest profession in the world wasn't able to advertise services they might have to return to the street and that would have the far worse consequence for residents of kerb crawling and associated crime.
Why not charge BT for having the council street cleaners clear all cards on a daily basis as part of their routine. On a sat/sun morning Newington Causeway is littered with flyers for gigs which the cleaners have to sweep and I'm sure it's the same surrounding all late night clubs in SE1. Are flyers for gigs placed on cars a priority.
Instead of arresting persistent carders and taking them to court maybe they could be sentenced to a 'Correction lesson by Miss Caine'

SmartAlec wrote:

There is usually a strong connection between prostitution and drug related activity, with other crimes resulting from it, which we should not underestimate.

Even if this is true, wouldn't it be a priority to deal with ACTUAL crimes, rather than something which may have a link to something else which in turn may be in some way criminal?

Davies wrote:

Is there a public record of how many people complained about this or is this just a soft target that doesn't involve actually having to try to catch muggers, vandals and thieves?

This is a very good question indeed.

Any idea where the minutes of the meeting/s can be found?

The leaflet in question gives an email address Chaucer.SNT@met.police.uk so perhaps they could answer your question.

I've just written to them asking to be sent updates and also hear about the meetings.

I've also written about something that concerns me which I wish they would address (it's cylists riding through red lights and riding on pavements - but I shall say no more as I don't want to disrupt this thread!)

I also thought adverts in phone boxes was an odd priority when I got the leaflet but I guess the thing to do is tell them what we think our priorities are and then see what happens