To sympathise with Canon Jeffrey John

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Monday 7 July 2003 8.13pm
Despite being a committed non-believer in organised religion of any sort, I was rather saddened to hear the result of this saga. No one wins and no one comes out of it with any merit or dignity except the victim, Canon Jeffrey John.

I'd like to wish him good luck in whatever he does in the future. I am sure he is a man too good for the organisation in which he is labouring.

His best option would seem to be to up sticks and join the opposition, whatever that may be.

Or perhaps better but harder, to become the the focus for humanitarian reform within the CofE and try to drag them screaming into the 21st century.

Or found his own church.
Like Martin Luther... another brave man who fought the prejudiced religious establishment of his time.

Don't despair and don't let the b******s grind you down !!
Monday 7 July 2003 11.53pm
Martin Luther didn't compromise his beliefs.
I assume the Canon sees himself as a genuine committed
christian and am disappointed he didn't have the courage
to stand up and be counted.
In the 21st century it's beyond me how anyone can believe
humans are the creation of a divine power, but if they do then
surely this power created all humans equally, so the Canon
showed a complete lack of courage by backing down under
pressure from -as I understand it- Nigerian anglicans.

Post edited (07 Jul 03 23:55)
Tuesday 8 July 2003 1.54am
The problem in this situation is that no one is telling the truth out loud, so we have to keep surmising what is going on behind closed doors.

I doubt we will ever know what really happened.

It's easy to see why the church is no longer relevant for the bulk of the population in this country. With this behaviour, they are merely accelerating their ultimate consignment to oblivion.

Post edited (08 Jul 03 01:58)
Tuesday 8 July 2003 9.40am
Charles - I completely agree with you.

I'm sure that the ninety odd percent of the population who do not go to Church every Sunday are scratching their heads trying to understand the treatment the Canon has received from an organisation that is supposed to treat everyone as equal and teaches you to "love thy neighbour".

The whole episode has served to emphaise how outdated, illiberal and out of touch the Church is in modern society. If the Church wanted to set an example about respecting every individual, it would not have treated the Canon with the contempt he received, which only serves to reinforce homophobia in society at a time when being gay is increasingly acceptable.

I have nothing but sympathy for the Canon, who has unnecessarily had his name, reputation and private life dragged through the gutter.

All institutions - no matter how venerable - have to modernise to keep pace with society. It's simple to see that if the Church does not face up to these changes, it's marching towards the cliffs of oblivion.

And the Church wonders why there are so many empty pews!?!
Tuesday 8 July 2003 9.46am
Please remember that those who have impeded Canon John's appointment do not speak for the whole Church of England - in most places the church is open to all, and many are furious about what has happened this week.

Those who gave the Dean of Southwark a standing ovation on Sunday morning when he said that what had happened was "not in his name" are already working for a church that is far from "outdated, illiberal and out of touch" - sadly this work has been set back by the latest turn of events.

Post edited (08 Jul 03 09:49)

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Tuesday 8 July 2003 12.00pm

I am sure what you say is true.

But the church is obviously firmly under the control of the outdated, illiberal and out of touch characters within its doors, and so that is how the entire organisation is being perceived by the outside world.

The CEO has to take the ultimate responsibility for a corporate culture and if he doesn't change things, then we assume he is happy with them.

In this case, we look to the Archbishop for guidance and if he lets the decision over Canon Jeffrey John stand, he obviously agrees with it. Wringing his hands and condemning the bad guys won't cut the mustard.

This is a real crisis for the Church and fudging the issue is not the answer. They have reached a fork in the road and they have to decide which of them are going in which direction in the future.

Speaking brutally, for the bulk of the population in the UK, it is all just an irrelevant sideshow, which just reinforces their prejudice over the inadequacies of the church in the modern world.

"Cometh the hour, cometh the man."
Well the hour has come, so let us hope that within the ranks of all the decent-minded people inside the church, one can step forward to provide the leadership they are all obviously looking for.

Post edited (08 Jul 03 12:18)
Sunday 20 July 2003 12.39am
The yanks are coming, the yanks are coming !

Step up Canon Gene Robinson...,2763,1001309,00.html,2763,1001443,00.html

Praise the lord and pass the ammunition !

Meanwhile, on the heterosexual front:,6903,1001664,00.html

Post edited (20 Jul 03 01:48)

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