Service charges

Jerry you are right and at this point we are getting in an accountant to REALLY go through the books for the last five/seven years. It's a laborious job and only one for professionals (RA committee members have jobs and even if they were qualified wouldnt be able to do this kind of forensic investigation). When I say "I dont know what FOR", I look at our rather shabby building, in a not particularly grand location and compare to where my parents live, in untold splendour in a huge flat in Chelsea, with deep pile carpets in every common area, gorgeous chandeliers, video entry to every flat, uniformed porters, postal delivery to each door, etc., and they dont pay what I pay! And I have none of the above. And they live in a big block too, 300 plus flats. But if you say £5 a squ. foot is the norm, then my charge is not so far out. But why we should be paying top whack is a mystery. It certainly ain't no top whack establishment! I wouldnt complain otherwise.

Sounds like a very sensible approach, Jackie.

Has anyone tried getting procurement consultants in to review service charges? I mean the kind of people who go into companies and find ways of saving money and don't get paid unless they identify real savings?

Some of the big increases in our building came from huge hikes in utilities and insurance (terrorism cover in particular). We shopped around and made big savings. But I'm mindful of Jackie's point that people have day jobs hence the enquiy about procurement consultants.

<Groan> We are in the awkward position of being in a property with mixed use - commercial and residential. Our 'management company' has never managed residential properties before and are absolutely atrocious - they show very little respect for us as property owners and do not respond to issues, concerns etc in anything resembling a timely manner. Fortunately as a group of owners we are pretty united (although some are more active than others!) and have relatives etc with the right kind of experience to be able to advise us. We are waiting on them to come back to us about a date for a meeting when hopefully we can get some of our issues addressed.

Our service charges certainly are very reasonable but we don't feel that we are getting a reasonable level of service for them! And this includes the 'unseen' things like basic maintenance...

One of the most aggravating things in our block is that we have TWO food outlets on the ground floor, and the smell of hot fat permeates the entire complex...it smells like a chippy. I have complained to the council and to everyone else - why the filtering system or whatever is necessary isnt efficient I dont know, but it really is ghastly. THen we have a thoroughly nasty convenience (not) shop, which strews enormous amounts of rubbish around. The owners have a huge Alsatian dog which is either in the shop or in the small area outside sh-tting, which REALLY makes the place look disgusting. Our managing agent seems to neither wish, nor be able to do anything about this...they take the rent and b-gger off. THis is what I find so atrocious.

That really is bad. Just to be clear, in relation to something I posted yesterday, £5 a square foot isn't an accepted norm, but it might be considered the upper limit of what is acceptable. £4 a square foot is in fact considered quite a high service charge; the "normal" range is £2 to £5 per square foot, but in buildings with many communal amenities (e.g. lifts, gym, gardens, roof terraces) you will be looking at the upper end of this scale. If you have a gym on site, as seems to be implicit in one of the other posts, this can be a very significant cost.

I don't understand why a gym should be a significant cost? Ours is a room with machines in it, and brand new ones at that, paid for by our insurance after a flood last year.
It isn't manned by anyone.

Unmanned gyms are cheaper than manned ones, granted, but there are still some quite punitive costs, such as public liability insurance, as well as often surprisingly high heating and lighting charges and the costs of servicing/repair of equipment. It's one of the many things that stack up to make service charges exorbitant.

And my roof terrace is not any part of the expense of the building it is maintained by ME, (and just now is full of scaffolding and beams as the painters who are doing the outside of the building are abseiling off my terrace. They will be there for two months or so, I have a)no privacy b)no use of my terrace. And do you think I will be compensated in any way? Dont bother asking). Sarah is quite right, any "improvements" in the leisure centre have been paid for by the insurance after a flood. The outside of the building is being paid for by our sinking fund - i.e. money from our service charges. Actually our gym/pool centre is a cause of a lot of griping - I dont use them actualy, but that's not the point - because there are always problems.

Another point. Our leases say "No students. No multiple lettings". What a JOKE. THe place is awash with students bunking up three to a bed. Do the management do anything? No they dont. But if you're two seconds late with paying your service charge you have a threatening letter and court orders. All this is not against our building - it's against Peverel our managing agent. THey are just awful.

But Jackie - someone is instructing Peverel (however badly) and they should be telling Peveral to start action to enforce the leases (against that shop owner with that dog too). Who is the landlord?

Your lease might also allow you take action against the shop owner if you wanted. You don't need a lawyer to go to County Court arbitration.

If the dog is causing a nuisance the Council should act. If they don't - start the complaints procedure and go to the Local Government Ombudsman. This is the only way we find we can get Lambeth to act but it does get results - and it's free and easy to do.

Unfortunately, Peverel are also our landlord...that's the trouble. They own the building AND they manage it...so you can bet they arent going to regulate themselves!! Not only that but they pay themselves commission on the services they order from themselves if you read me..it's a complete joke. I've complained about the shop and the dog till I'm blue in the face.