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Destroying the character of Bermondsey Street

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Tuesday 5 July 2011 9.34am
Mass transit is already overloaded in london....rather than just keep building ever taller chicken coops for people to live in there should be some sort of plan to move employment opportunities out of central London...but that's a much more complicated argument than dealing with individual planning applications.

Yes the 3 sisters have never come to fruition (thankfuly IMHO) but most likely because there is a groudswell opinion now developing against overly dense developments...something I was trying to highlight.

The Recall/White Cube site was pulled beacuse the density the developers tried was seen as incompatible witht he neighbourhood after the Council questioned many of the design features.

The question is will development ruin what is a very pleasant area to live in...not least because of its lack of density?
Tuesday 5 July 2011 1.20pm
Unless I have missed something, I thought the White Cube planning application was approved? There certainly is alot of movement on that site with builders and the like.

The 3 Sisters/House etc. I would be mindful of assuming that is a done deal, it is highly likely there will be another planning application put in for that site.

Also, for those who might be interested.... I heard that Threadneedle Estates, the owners of Beckett House on St Thomas St, next to Capital House have submitted a Judicial Review on the Quill planning application on the basis of a lack of an Environmental Impact Assessment or something along those lines.....

Interesting.... Always thought the Quill was ridiculously expensive Student Accommodation
Tuesday 5 July 2011 1.27pm
Urbanite,

I hear what you are saying. I do not see anything that explains why density is a negative as an absolute. You are saying the infrastructure is a bit taxed. With the rebuild of the station and the new layout for the bus station, the infrastructure will support bigger numbers.

Urban sprawl vs. density seems to be the extremes of the discussion.

Other than keeping things as they are, what is wrong with continued growth in employment and housing?
Tuesday 5 July 2011 1.36pm
The 3 Sisters are not going to happen any time soon. Network Rail needs the space for the station rebuild. The car park will be used to park equipment. The station rebuild will not finish until 2018 based on current plans.
Tuesday 5 July 2011 1.57pm
I agree that infrastructure is very heavily loaded in London...

That's one of the many reasons why it makes great sense to encourage people to live near their jobs, or near links with spair capacity. Schemes like 3 Sisters are ideal for this, for anyone working in the city they would be an easy walk or cycle to work and it's right by London Bridge (which will have capacity when the work is done).

I think at essence this is the oft repeated argument between those in SE1 who see it as part of central London (and so an area with a great deal of unexplored potential), and those who would prefer it to be an inner suburb (and broadly happy with things as they are).

I'm strongly part of the first, but that's a political decision, and each to their own.
Tuesday 5 July 2011 4.00pm
Don't disagree with you, Jamesup. More people living in cities could be a great thing.

But given the density in SE1 already (and considering the huge change in that density since, say, 10 yrs ago), I'd say that London should build more living spaces in, say, the City, and let the SE1 infrastructure catch up with the relatively recent influx of people before building more homes here.

I think it's important to realise that, whatever one would prefer (in terms of classifying SE1 as an inner suburb or as central London), SE1 has always been residential to a reasonably large extent, and imho one should give consideration to the people who've lived here for generations. (To clarify, I'm an incomer. Only been here for a little over 10 yrs, or so.)

...if you press it, they will come.
Tuesday 5 July 2011 4.09pm
historically though (talking centuries ago) the SE1 area, especially The Borough, was probably the densest populated part of London. Its just re-assuming that role again...without all the filth, bear baiting and prostitutes
Tuesday 5 July 2011 4.22pm
Exactly.

If the E&C development is going to respect the history of the area we need at least twice as muchfilth, bear baiting and prostitution as is proposed.
Tuesday 5 July 2011 4.55pm
I believe the master plan for Greater London shows Southwark as adding 25,000 more homes and 2,000 more jobs. The third financial centre for London is expected to be the London Bridge area given it is well connected to the City and Canary Wharf.

In some recent planning conversations it was noted that the council has an interest in retaining businesses, specifically warehouses in the Bermondsey Street area. The precise accuracy might be challenged. The point I want to make is the area is full of commercial buildings so it is a little hard to say it was a residential area. Mixed use is likely the only reasonable label.

As a couple of people have noted, the history of the area has periods of industrial use which are far from being friendly to residential use. The area was also known as a slum at various points.

While it might be argued that those who have been here a long time have some sort of priority, very few can honestly say their families were always in the area. By this I mean the area has had various groups moving in and out, many tied to the employment prospects in the greater area. Change is a historical feature of the area and in some ways more change means being authentic to the spirit of the area. Tower Bridge Road did not exist at one point so a number of buildings were lost when the road was built.

Sympathetic change might be the right phrase.

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