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Tuesday 5 April 2011 12.55pm
Isn't that a contradiction in terms? You can be localist, or you can have a one-size-fits-all approach.

Of course people living east of Tower Bridge Road should have the same rights and opportunities - and once the localism legislation is enacted, everyone will. But whether/how people choose to take up those new rights is another matter.

Everyone should certainly be alert to the risk that only the most articulate and better-off people will be heard - but that risk IMO shouldn't be used an argument for not innovating and experimenting.

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Tuesday 5 April 2011 1.33pm
James
But you can have a reasonable definition of what 'localist' means... and I would argue that in this instance it means a wider catchment area... as those individuals have a legitimate interest in planning decisions and other decision making in the area.
It is perfectly possible to be localist re..eg. accountability but to believe in a one size fits all approach to e.g. some public service provision.
Is it not a strange coincidence that some of the more affluent and articulate people live west of the tower bridge road? Or perhaps you don't agree.
Not good at acronyms.. what is IMO?
Tuesday 5 April 2011 2.06pm
(IMO - in my opinion)

Have you considered going along to the next meeting of the Bermondsey Neighbourhood Forum and arguing your case for a wider area to be included in the community plan? As I understand it the boundaries are not yet set in stone.

In any event I imagine there will also be some opportunity for those who don't actually live within the final boundary of the plan area, but feel some affinity to it (or, for example, use schools/shops/services within it) to have an input into the process.

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Tuesday 5 April 2011 3.06pm
James

Having taken the government shilling.. I do not imagine for one minute that the Bermondsey Neighbourhood Forum would consider a wider area in the community plan ( call it scepticism, realpolitik.. what you will!) Having met one or two DCLG policy geeks in the past I wouldn't say I was overwhelmed with their flexibility and I can't image that the bermondsey neighbourhood forum would want to upset its new big brother.
Tuesday 5 April 2011 6.08pm
londonbridge69 wrote:
James
Having taken the government shilling.. I do not imagine for one minute that the Bermondsey Neighbourhood Forum would consider a wider area in the community plan ( call it scepticism, realpolitik.. what you will!) Having met one or two DCLG policy geeks in the past I wouldn't say I was overwhelmed with their flexibility and I can't image that the bermondsey neighbourhood forum would want to upset its new big brother.

So - all these objections, but not willing to try to do anything about it...?!
Tuesday 5 April 2011 6.45pm
Andy ABC

Thats democracy!or are you volunteering? You're comments might be valid if you were talking to someone who had no or little experience of local forums/decision making.. but unfortunately I have had over 10 years of it and one thing I have learnt.. is to know which battles to choose!! You might not like it.. but it's a truth hard earned.
Tuesday 5 April 2011 9.12pm
I think it all looks pretty sensible, so no objections from me!
Tuesday 5 April 2011 9.16pm
Its clearly as easy as ABC :)
Saturday 9 April 2011 11.29am
The geography is all confused round here though, isn't it? Between estate agents, human geography, and bureaucrats, it's not clear in SE16 which way is up.

So Bermondsey tube station and town hall won't be in Bermondsey any more. South Bermondsey rail station is in Livesey Ward; South Bermondsey Ward stops at Rotherhithe New Road. Surrey Quays tube station is in Rotherhithe Ward, which stretches as far south as Lidl, while most of the Rotherhithe peninsula is in Surrey Docks ward.
jpm
Monday 11 April 2011 10.19pm
londonbridge69 - you start your first post with a very interesting argument which was, pretty much "it's wrong to self-define an area, but the area you've defined is wrong (according to me)". There is irony in there.

Communities are interesting things and when you're thinking of defining the area for a community, the boundaries have to be small enough that the people in the area see themselves as one, while big enough to be a sensible size.

The whole point of the Government's localism agenda is - entirely - that you do 'do it yourself' (or it doesn't get done). That's what the group of people calling themselves Bermondsey Neighbourhood Forum have done. That's what a similar group of people in Bankside have done. There's nothing to stop you (or anyone else) doing their own thing in whatever area they choose to define. All you need to do is get enough people together who agree to a common purpose and on the common area to be their community. Find the people and set it up...

I don't agree that it's the council/government rules and boundaries or inward investment that lead to the definition of a community's boundaries. It's about finding a group of people who are sufficiently motivated to work together and do something about an issue. It's their time and effort, so let them set the rules. (oh, and beingjdc, you're right, there's never any real correlation between what a council area/station name is called and how people see it. I'm from Manchester and Withington Village wasn't in the council area called 'Withington', it was in the next-door area called 'Old Moat' - most of these things are to do with the best name people can think of at the time, not what is truly sensible.

Yes, naming things is really difficult. Is it just the name 'Bermondsey Neighbourhood Forum' that you don't like because you think it refers to a different area than the one you're thinking of?

Interestingly, I'm surprised you've not heard of 'West Bermondsey' before as there have been a number of local organisations using 'West Bermondsey' as a name. Look elsewhere on this website and you'll still find references to the now-defunct West Bermondsey Community Forumwhich related to pretty much the same area as this new group. They were originally called 'West Bermondsey 98' so I'm guessing they were using that name years and years ago!

It might be confusing for this new group to call itself 'West Bermondsey Neighbourhood Forum', because of the WBCF - but as I've pointed out already people do get hung up on names.


So come and set up the Old Bermondsey Forum to deal with they area you're discussing. There's plenty of room for everyone!
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