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Reed.. Agora... Paddy power... Coral.. As bad as an high street can get

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Saturday 4 June 2011 3.15am
orione wrote:
Phoney I am not sure what you are trying to state...
I have played in the casino but I don't feel a libertine.
I am saying that 5 betting agencies in BHS are unnecessary and they don't help the development of a community. Often is a source of failure for many individuals. You are confusing the cards with that message.

Edward Woodward I agree with you. I hope you read that I have been living in an estate for 10 years and In fact what I am saying is that the council, in face of the massive development that London Bridge is having, should make sure that everybody can share some kind of development. For many would be access to education and culture and jobs. And you can only reach this with a clear intent to have an impact. Opening betting agency everywhere does not follow that strategy for sure. It is too easy for the council to beg and rely on every capitalist that come to the area.... To have affordable houses in return. Great propaganda for cheap


Orione, I don't know what it is with you, but I don't buy anything you're saying on any topic you post on. Your posts just sound wishy-washy, you're not really making any point. Sometimes it seems you're on the side of e.g. BM, who, currently, are against the community I have happily been part of for the last 12 years, and then you seem to want to accommodate / approach that same SE1 community. Well, it doesn't work, and when you say you agree with me, sorry, no, you don't.
Saturday 4 June 2011 9.47am
What I want to know about BHS is why those 2 buildings (the old shoe shop and musical instrument shop?) have been in scaffold for years with nothing being done to them. They're a real eyesore! In a similar vein there's a plot of unused land on the Walworth Rd next to the Barclays Bank which has stood empty without being developed for as long as I can remember...

Walworth Rd is actually a lot better for shopping than BHS. We've got Morrisons, M&S, 2 Tescos Metros, Boots, Superdrug, Iceland, Argos, Holland & Barret, Baldwins and the wonderful 24hr Ollies supermarket/deli. Come and move to SE17. It's cheaper and better!!!
Saturday 4 June 2011 10.02am
I am not making any point? Have you read what i have said?
There is an article just now out on the first page of London se1 stating the same things.

Ok I tell you again what I am saying, if you still are aggressive with me you just have problem reading or you are intolerant.

This area is developing rapidly and many people who have lived here for years and years in state of poverty, even if before could afford enough to live now the are in trouble because they can't make it to the end of the month unless they have a job.

This happen and I am not making it up. We should not go into details of these consequences because I guess many can have an idea what happen if you don't have enough money from the government and you need a job.

In this climate I believe the council should follow a strategy aimed to improve the conditions of those people left behind who are many Halas..

This can be achieved with education and more jobs available.

If you fill street with betting agency and offices instead of retail you are just going against what you should do. Because you create even more the ground to perpetuate such a condition.

What you mean wish washy? Have you read the article in first page? What I have said wrong and what has borough Market to do with this?

And about helping the community you don't know what I am doing. Now let me know what is wrong in what I am saying ?

Many people like you or me have lived in this community for years. You 12 me 9...

But other have lived happly in a condition that now is not sustainable anymore because everything has changed around. To help those people unless you need to create the ground. And I believe the council is following the same greedy business strategy of any other privets corporation. Neo Darwinism will not help those people who are now behind.

Less betting agencies, less ground floor offices more retails, more affordable schools and more culture in the streets. Am I wish washy?? Am I against you?
Saturday 4 June 2011 10.12am
They belong to kings college. Another institution who is playing with house Market waiting for the best moment to sell.. And keeping the whole street on hold for their private interests.
Saturday 4 June 2011 10.41am
The two points you made orione that irritated me and prompted an over-reaction was first the wild generalisation: "Honestly the fact is that these shops are generally a cause of nuisance because they are visited mainly by ..... Can't find the right word.."
and second the rambling: "Maybe just one thing. I give you an example.. Abroad you can bet but you will go into local bars or into corner shops.. Kind of.. So you bet and you go home. You don't hang around and it is not a betting Mecca. If you wan to bet in the other way ... You go to the casino. In this way you keep a place sociable because everybody can go there for coffee, buying stationary.. Or betting."

Are you suggesting that betting should be moved from licensed, regulated, tax paying premises to the corner shop?
There's no doubt that BHS would benefit from a more diverse selection of shops but the premises available are far too small in floor space to attract most chains. All the larger premises have been taken by such as the school of osteopathy and other educational institutions. At least there are no kebab shops, 99p or charity shops on BHS.
Saturday 4 June 2011 10.45am
At least there are no kebab shops, 99p or charity shops on BHS.

... yet.
Saturday 4 June 2011 10.57am
Phoney I give up. If you are irritated I am sorry. What can I say . I understand that you are not prepared to consider any other model but the one you have lived in or ever.. In 2011 you can bet anywhere even online. There is no reason to have a spread of betting agencies in tje street when you need other things. Why are you so stubborn to defend them! I am not saying there shouldnt be.. But there should be less! Come on man. I hate empty discussions. Lets organise a group trip into everyday life of sauthwark betting agencies.. Be prepared to have fun!

What is wrong with charity shops anyway?

And yes no kebab but saucy pasta ,cheap sandwiches, KFC (what a luxury) and now take away only Starbucks . Is this better?

Anyway, have a good weekend. Everybody.
Monday 6 June 2011 11.22am
And you can add to that list about half a dozen estate agents in the same stretch...

The issue is though, what are the councillors supposed to do? This is privately owned property - should they be blocking landlords from selling leases to betting shops, estate agents or sandwich shops? Are there other businesses that are looking to open in those places but are being overlooked in favour of betting shops / estate agents etc? I'm guessing not.

The large building on the corner of Union Street is owned by a very large corporate land company, and I know for a fact that they wouldn't consider selling the lease to a small independent - they want chains etc. to give them more security. (actually, I know that the councillors did block a betting shop from opening there last year as they were trying to get round some rules over the number of machines they could have or similar).

Either way, it's still boarded up, and has been for at least 6 years.

(On another point, if you were a small independent business looking to open up, you've almost got no chance with the banks these days, but that's a whole other issue...)

Secondly, if no-one used any of those shops then there wouldn't be any. If people used the smaller independent shops more than the chains then we wouldn't have as many Starbucks , Tescos, Sainsbury's etc. Also, I'm not sure if it's been noted on another post, but Hiba the Lebanese restaurant has stopped trading. I'm sure this wasn't because they were making too much money, but 20% vat and increased food prices, duty and rates certainly don't help.

Perhaps rather than 'stopping' the proliferation of betting shops and estate agents, the council could do more to encourage independent shops through lower rates, access to finance etc. But then with council cutbacks, where is that money going to come from? They need the rates money for council services and having a row of empty shops not paying rates isn't going to help.

Lastly, what really baffles me, is that BHS was a one-way building site for most of last year whilst Thames Water replaced the drains. It's now a one-way building site again, and once the current work is finished it's going to be a one-way street full of roadworks for another 9 months whilst they resurface it. 3 years of roadworks and one-way access doesn't make it any easier for existing businesses or attractive for new ones...
Monday 6 June 2011 12.26pm
orione wrote:
If you fill street with betting agency and offices instead of retail you are just going against what you should do.

Betting shops *are* retail. They employ about as many people as a similar sized bookshop, as they continue trading and paying their rates and taxes.

I have no axe to grind on behalf of the betting industry. I seldom place a bet in a betting shop, but if I go into my local one four times a year then that's four times more than I go into nearly every other single shop on BHS.

Just because you don't like betting shops, Orione, I don't understand why they should be removed.

As for your point about the PMU/Tote system in operation in several other countries, I think you're being a bit rose-tinted in your views. My recollection of the PMU bars I've been in in small french towns are that they are just like betting shops except that they have beer.

...if you press it, they will come.
Monday 6 June 2011 1.13pm
Ivanhoe you have got ham covering your eyes.

I seriously believe that other kind of retail are missed and specially I believe in creating a variety of them. As I SAID AND I REPEAT I HAVE NOTHING AGAINST BETTING AGENCIES !!!!! AND ALSO I DO NOT WANT TO CLOSE THEM ALL!!! I AM SAYING THAT IF YOU HAVE FIVE IN 200mt AND NOTHING ELSE YOU ARE NOT DOING GOOD TO THE COMMUNITY!

I am not the only one saying that, please read above what other say and also read the article about the southwark coucillor who is acting towards this matter.

I said what I think the council should do earlier. It is not BHS, it is Walworth it is the Cut it is Southwark council policy to let it happen. Go to other boroughs and you will see the difference. We can organize a trip.

Thank you!
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