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Sick of all the push bikers jumping lights on Borough High St

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Current: 9 of 45
Monday 21 May 2012 12.30pm
Guy's street wrote:
Regarding under-taknig by cyclists - someone mentioned undertaking a car signalling left. Is it perhaps a little inconsiderate/dangerous of a person in a car to overtake a person on a bike just before they turn left in their car? They know they will cutting up the person on the bike by doing so - why not hang back and wait until the junction is clear?

There are rules about undertaking for some very real reasons...undertaking is dangerous and is the most prevalant cause it seems of cycle injury....cars and lorrys can't see often (drivers' blind spot) if there is a cycle there...and stopping for no good/perccieved reason in the mid flow of traffic at a junction also causes problems for all road users. Why can't cyclists be patient and use the road in the way the rules ask?
Monday 21 May 2012 12.48pm
Guy's street wrote:
Regarding under-taknig by cyclists - someone mentioned undertaking a car signalling left. Is it perhaps a little inconsiderate/dangerous of a person in a car to overtake a person on a bike just before they turn left in their car? They know they will cutting up the person on the bike by doing so - why not hang back and wait until the junction is clear?

I wouldn't overtake a cyclist when I wanted to turn left immediately afterwards. It's rude, and potentially dangerous.

However, there are still several times when I'm indicating to turn left, slowing down, and taking up a road position on the left hand side of the carriageway, only to find a cyclist coming at speed from behind me and trying to cut up my inside to go straight on.

It's part of my normal drill for turning left to check my inside blind spot before turning. I don't want to have an accident, and I'll continue to do this extra check in order to try and prevent one, but I do find it annoying that I have to do this just because I know that a significant proportion of other road users will choose to act so dangerously and inconsiderately. I can see why others become frustrated with the cyclists who seem determined to take silly risks like this. Act as if you've got no regard for your own safety, and what message are others supposed to take out of that?

All the people I know who've had lessons to pass their motorbike test in London have been told by their instructor that this is a danger they need to look out for, so I'm guessing that it's not just me who's had this experience with some regularity.

...if you press it, they will come.
Monday 21 May 2012 1.09pm
Ivanhoe, I agree with you - but given the speed the the two vehicles travel at, I find it hard to imagine in most cases that for the cyclist be crossing a junction as the car is turning left, the car has not recently overtaken that bike, knowing full well they are going to have to turn across the path of that bike to make the left turn. Unless there is a long line of traffic turning left which has slowed down the traffic flow.

The over-riding point in the discussion is that cycling should be encouraged within the city. There are benefits for everyone, but more education needs to be in place for everyone, and suitable lawas need to be in place, and enforced, for all concerned.
Monday 21 May 2012 1.28pm
I am a daily cyclist (commuter).I am also a driver. Whether I am on my bike or in my car, like it or not I am a ROAD VEHICLE, that means I am governed by the highway code. Which means, riding on the pavement, jumping red lights, undertaking etc etc are all ILLEGAL.
This morning a van driver hooted at a cyclist who squeezed past me to run a red light (no helmet, trousers tucked in socks... no lycra). The "cyclist" turned as if to give abuse to be confronted by 5 other cyclists waiting patiently for the light to turn green all of us shaking our heads... he ran the light anyway... oh well. I believe that cyclists should become more self governing, if you see someone running a light/ on the pavement etc... say something, you don't have to be aggressive or sarcastic just let them know that what they are doing is a) wrong and b) non-constructive to making London a safer greener city.
Monday 21 May 2012 1.33pm
Guy's Street there are laws in place...they say don't undertake and don't jump lights!
Monday 21 May 2012 2.31pm
Guy's street wrote:
Ivanhoe, I agree with you - but given the speed the the two vehicles travel at, I find it hard to imagine in most cases that for the cyclist be crossing a junction as the car is turning left, the car has not recently overtaken that bike, knowing full well they are going to have to turn across the path of that bike to make the left turn. Unless there is a long line of traffic turning left which has slowed down the traffic flow...

Yes. You are quite right. I am making it all up.

Either that, or I'm actually telling the truth and you're just wittering on trying to blindly defend cyclists any which way you can.

I'm happy to let the other posters decide (but I'll give you a clue. For road users other than cyclists, a lot of time is spent waiting in stationary traffic, or stopped at a red light. Now, if I see a vehicle - of any kind - ahead of me in a queue, indicating to turn left, I wouldn't try to take a path up its inside. Whereas many cyclists seem to think this is acceptable, if not obligatory).

...if you press it, they will come.
Monday 21 May 2012 3.02pm
Ivanhoe wrote:
Guy's street wrote:
Ivanhoe, I agree with you - but given the speed the the two vehicles travel at, I find it hard to imagine in most cases that for the cyclist be crossing a junction as the car is turning left, the car has not recently overtaken that bike, knowing full well they are going to have to turn across the path of that bike to make the left turn. Unless there is a long line of traffic turning left which has slowed down the traffic flow...

Yes. You are quite right. I am making it all up.

Either that, or I'm actually telling the truth and you're just wittering on trying to blindly defend cyclists any which way you can.

I'm happy to let the other posters decide (but I'll give you a clue. For road users other than cyclists, a lot of time is spent waiting in stationary traffic, or stopped at a red light. Now, if I see a vehicle - of any kind - ahead of me in a queue, indicating to turn left, I wouldn't try to take a path up its inside. Whereas many cyclists seem to think this is acceptable, if not obligatory).

I didn't say the cyclist shouldn't slow down and wait for the car to turn left once the car is ahead and signalling left. But if the driver of the car held back a little initially then it wouldn't be an issue. As far as I see it, there's a bit more common sense which could be shown by both people.
Monday 21 May 2012 3.05pm
urbanite wrote:
Guy's Street there are laws in place...they say don't undertake and don't jump lights!
Yep - funnily enough both laws regularly flouted by people driving cars, as well as cyclists.
What are the laws on 'undertaking' when the cyclist is in a clearly marked cycle-lane, such as the blue ones? Not trying to catch anyone out, I just genuinely don't know - this route is effectively part of the road, and often crossed by buses and taxis, and intersects junctions where cars may want to turn left.

Is there a different rule for people cycling on this sort of route, rather than just on the road?
Monday 21 May 2012 3.17pm
Guy's Street,
It was me who posted re the undertaking cyclists and, with respect, you wrongly assumed that the car had just overtaken them. Exactly as in Ivanhoe's experience, the car had slowed down and was signalling left when the cyclists came up behind him at speed.
I listened to a bloke on the radio the other day, talking about trials being set up in certain areas with a view to doing away with traffic lights altogether. The theory is that it would help traffic flow as motorists would proceed when the road was clear, rather than stop at a timed red light when there was nothing coming the other way, and give way when there was. I admired his faith in human nature, but he really should get out more. I wondered if he'd ever heard of the word, 'Gridlock.' Wasn't this why traffic lights were installed in the first place? And there were fewer cars on the roads back then.
Monday 21 May 2012 3.24pm
Guy's street wrote:
urbanite wrote:
Guy's Street there are laws in place...they say don't undertake and don't jump lights!
Yep - funnily enough both laws regularly flouted by people driving cars, as well as cyclists.
What are the laws on 'undertaking' when the cyclist is in a clearly marked cycle-lane, such as the blue ones? Not trying to catch anyone out, I just genuinely don't know - this route is effectively part of the road, and often crossed by buses and taxis, and intersects junctions where cars may want to turn left.

Is there a different rule for people cycling on this sort of route, rather than just on the road?


When the blue cycle land has a fixed white line dividing it from the vehicle lane it is a cycle only lane...when the white line is broken it is a lane for anyone to use and is part of the vehicle lane. Where blue lanes approach junctions they are invariably broken white lanes and therefore not cycle lanes but part of the vehicle lane they are next to. In such cases (most if not all to the best of my knowledge) therfore cycles should not undertake coming towards a junction.
Current: 9 of 45

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