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Bike 'gate' on Trinity Street

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Saturday 11 October 2014 6.34pm
?"official detour"????
It's just a case of using the roads which have always been there and available.

...if you press it, they will come.
Saturday 11 October 2014 6.50pm
Sorry Ivanhoe if I didn't make myself clear: much of the discussion from the council's pov was about being entirely inclusive of disabled cyclists etc. To be inclusive they will need to make official proposals and no doubt if the gate were retained the map on Southwark's website for the route would give an alternative route for those with large motorised cycles. I myself use the route avoiding the gate all the time but the council have to tick their boxes and make sure everyone is included, which as part of their process would involve consulting those affected by the new route options, in the same way as residents were consulted re. the initial proposals.

The council's report is here: http://moderngov.southwark.gov.uk/documents/s48802/Report%20Quietway%20cycling%20proposals.pdf
Saturday 11 October 2014 7.31pm
Oh, thanks Karen.
I've never seen a large motorised cycle. Have no concept of what that might be. The diversion is pretty obvious, though, I'd have thought.

...if you press it, they will come.
Saturday 11 October 2014 11.32pm
I was at the most recent Chaucer police ward panel meeting and the possibility was brought up about obtaining some CCTV cameras (apparently the council has a couple of mobile units) to deal with on-going drug use/dealing and associated anti-social behaviour in the ward. However, the council officers present said that it would be very unlikely that cameras could be acquired, and even if they were it would only be for a week or two.

Yet, even though the officer's report says there is no evidence to suggest the street will become a rat run for motorcyclists, it seems that cameras will be used for a 6-month 'trial' to police the Trinity Street barrier. I'm sure that Southwark Council will be glad of the chance to issue some fines, and it seems that the villagers have made their decision.
Saturday 11 October 2014 11.39pm
There are some interesting comments and visuals of the 'quietways' proposed for the Borough area, which seem to be to be an excuse to spend lots of money to make little difference:

http://departmentfortransport.wordpress.com/2014/08/27/how-to-get-from-waterloo-to-greenwich-the-hard-way/
Sunday 12 October 2014 11.33am
Ridiculous to have cameras there.
The space outside The Roebuck has a frequent problem with motorbikes using the shared cycle/pedestrian space. This causes actual danger to pedestrians, rather than the slight noise problem to (?two/three?) residents who live by The Trinity street gates.
If there are cameras going spare, I know where I'd put them...

...if you press it, they will come.
Sunday 12 October 2014 12.13pm
Ivanhoe wrote:
Ridiculous to have cameras there.
The space outside The Roebuck has a frequent problem with motorbikes using the shared cycle/pedestrian space. This causes actual danger to pedestrians, rather than the slight noise problem to (?two/three?) residents who live by The Trinity street gates.
If there are cameras going spare, I know where I'd put them...
It's part of the same problem. The motorcyclists who ride across the pavement outside the Roebuck are presumably the same ones who will, if the gate is removed, ride at high speed (ignoring the 20 mph limit) straight along Trinity Street. And that will certainly cause actual danger to pedestrians and cyclists on Trinity Street - and rather more than 'a slight noise problem'.
Sunday 12 October 2014 3.02pm
Not really.
Half the m/cs who cross by The Roebuck go down/come from Falmouth Rd.
And any who wiggle through the Trinity st gates (I don't actually see any, but let's assume some do, for the sake of your argument), have to slow down to a standstill to do so. They then go down T St gates at the same pace as the cars that go down Trinity St.
As for pedestrian risk on T St, I'm sorry but your point is illogical; m/cs crossing by The Roebuck are riding on pedestrian space - on the pavement, where ped's don't expect them. M/cs riding on the road down T St pose the same risk as cars - and I don't hear any of the T St campaigners suggesting that it's made a car- free zone (wonder why?)
I often ride my m/c down T St from Gt Suffolk St direction to Falmouth Rd, and I know that it's quicker and more convenient (not to mention it being legal) to take the Cole St route than to try and wiggle through the gates.

...if you press it, they will come.
Sunday 12 October 2014 4.17pm
Ivanhoe wrote:
Not really.
Half the m/cs who cross by The Roebuck go down/come from Falmouth Rd.
And any who wiggle through the Trinity st gates (I don't actually see any, but let's assume some do, for the sake of your argument), have to slow down to a standstill to do so. They then go down T St gates at the same pace as the cars that go down Trinity St.
As for pedestrian risk on T St, I'm sorry but your point is illogical; m/cs crossing by The Roebuck are riding on pedestrian space - on the pavement, where ped's don't expect them. M/cs riding on the road down T St pose the same risk as cars - and I don't hear any of the T St campaigners suggesting that it's made a car- free zone (wonder why?)
I often ride my m/c down T St from Gt Suffolk St direction to Falmouth Rd, and I know that it's quicker and more convenient (not to mention it being legal) to take the Cole St route than to try and wiggle through the gates.
Some Trinity residents are worried that 'opening' the gate will lead to a revival of the old rat-run linking Great Dover Street to the Great Suffolk Street junction that made Trinity Street such a dangerous road to cross (and that's why I said it would be dangerous for pedestrians).

I was easy about it; I had assumed there'd be no rat-run because to get to it motorcyclists would have to ride across the pavement by the Roebuck (and said so in an earlier post). You then revealed that 'The space outside The Roebuck has a frequent problem with motorbikes using the shared cycle/pedestrian space', which I'm afraid I was unaware of.

You now say that half of those motorcyclists are going to or from Falmouth Road - so I assume the other half are going to/from Trinity Street? The Council seem to be proposing to replace the present chicane by bollards with a central opening wide enough for a tricycle or mobility scooter, so no wiggling will required for a motorbike. If the gap in the gate is as wide as that, why on earth should motorcyclists who have already flouted the law by riding on the pavement by the Roebuck bother to follow the current diversion round Cole Street?

The situation you describe at the Roebuck is clearly dangerous - are the Council aware of it?
Sunday 12 October 2014 4.26pm
Oh well, the danger now diverts down Falmouth rd then on to Harper rd, where there are parks and children.

If only we were all looked after like the Trinity St residents.
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