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E & C Traffic Death

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Friday 5 February 2016 4.23pm
How sad. I sent an email to TFL customer services roads department on Jan 20th asking them to review a number of things at the E and C one being the traffic crossing across New Kent Road with no reply to date not that anything would have been done.

It states the driver has been arrested on suspicion of dangerous driving but how much of this could be attributed to shoddy crossings, shoddy information and lack of no grid lines at this junction.

Yeah, great idea getting rid of the subways. And looking at all the cyclists today yes they have a lane too the roundabout but once they are on the roundabout they are still as vunerable as they were before this debacle or me, only a question of time.
Friday 5 February 2016 6.09pm
Closing the subways was a travesty, filling them with concrete was a crime.
The sheer arrogance of TfL to simply make sure they cannot easily be re-opened appals me.
Saturday 6 February 2016 3.11pm
graham wrote:
Closing the subways was a travesty, filling them with concrete was a crime.
The sheer arrogance of TfL to simply make sure they cannot easily be re-opened appals me.

Not for nothing is the acronym TFL often said to mean Totally Failing London.
Saturday 6 February 2016 11.25pm
TFL have ignored all common sense. Roundabouts were made to slow traffic, now speeds at E&C are higher. Pedestrians have too far to walk to get over the road so naturally cross when they feel they can, I know I do. In the rain I am not going on a trek to cross the road. Dragging a trolley or pushing a buggy is hazardous, there are far too many steep kerbs...again I am not going for a 10 minuet walk to get to a dropped curb. I have watched a much higher number of people running across the road, dodging traffic since they messed up the system. TFL have to learn to listen to people and stop designing their consultations to get the result they want.
Saturday 6 February 2016 11.39pm
TfL are clearly in the firing line, but haven't I heard or read somewhere that TfL initially refused to implement such a road layout and only did so after repeated lobbying by Southwark? It is a complete disaster from all road users' perspectives and the previous arrangement.

Not for me to speculate, but I had wondered whether in fact the poor lady looked in the wrong direction before crossing, not expecting two-way traffic.
Sunday 7 February 2016 9.12am
The death was almost certainly avoidable had those who pushed for The Bend and it's increased dangers and risk taking incentivising congestion for all users listened to the many many critics before and since The Bend opened.

For those new to the debate read

1. The ongoing discussion on this SE1 thread:

2. Comments on the Evening Standard's news story:

3. Background to the warped local pressure for more surface crossings at the expense of safe segregated pedestrian subways

I am in the process of arranging a public meeting in place where both myself and others who have identified dangers and are concerned about having changes made can share thinking and propose a plan that goes beyond letter writing and tweeting about it. Please keep posted via and @roundaboutnews, or e-mail direct to

Conveniently this Thursday a Ringway Jacobs member of staff (tfl's contractor) is due to attend our TRA meeting at Perronet House so I may have more to update on imminently. Ringway Jacobs have been concerned about the dangers they are building and informed TfL in December of a number of risks. The reaction (or lack of it) from TfL was described to me as 'like a black hole'. We need to try and encourage local politicians (most of whom #backedthebend) to take the lead in looking at changes.
Sunday 7 February 2016 10.31am
I find it pretty distasteful the way people are using this tragic death to support the claim that TfL has actually made the junction more dangerous. Are their memories so short that they forget the frequency with which pedestrians were killed or seriously injured at Elephant and Castle over the past few years? How did the marvellous subways and superior traffic flows of the roundabout help those people?

This website includes statistics for the first 2 1/2 years months of this decade. There were 4 pedestrian deaths and 15 serious injuries at the junction during the period.

The impact of the new junction on traffic flows can be determined fairly soon after the work is completely finished. This can't be judged beforehand. That's despite Perronetonian's oft-repeated claim that the current situation won't improve because the new road layout is now in place is misleading. Drivers respond to traffic cones, temporary barriers and roadworks by slowing down; this can be enough to cause congestions by itself. A "roadworks ahead" sign can cause huge tailbacks on motorways even if there is no actual work going on.

However, whether or not the junction is safe, is going to take many months at the very least to judge. Fatalities are relatively rare events, therefore no one can judge statistically significant increases or decreases in the short term. Serious injuries over the first 12 months after completion will give a more reliable indication.
Sunday 7 February 2016 11.09am
James Johnston wrote:
How did the marvellous subways and superior traffic flows of the roundabout help those people?

By providing segregated and safe routes for all road users, the route/layout for road users being obvious to at least a half competent motorist.
Sunday 7 February 2016 2.31pm
I think James as I recall most injuries were from the Coronet to bus stops. Not near the top end of Nkr as from the diagram seems to show? I know the work is not completed but why were local people's views not taken into account, the ones who lived on top of it. It is a work still in progress, not quite sure from my limited understanding exactly what the progress means.
Sunday 7 February 2016 3.08pm
The consultation pages for TfL's scheme say that the design will be supported by road safety audits. Has anyone got a copy of these? An extensive web search hasn't turned up what should be public documents. Interestingly the search did find a reference in LB Southwark paper about a formal safety audit not having been done for the Blackfriars cycle superhighway: In the apparent absence of documents one might draw the conclusion that a formal safety audit is lacking for the Elephant scheme as well.
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