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Thameslink 2000 - 21 days to comment on new plans

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Tuesday 13 July 2004 11.05am
Blackfriars (road) Bridge is one of the bridges owned by the City of London's Bridge House Estates charity (the others being London Bridge, Southwark Bridge, Tower Bridge and most recently the Millennium Footbridge.

However, strangely it is the only bridge for which the City of London's boundaries cover the entire bridge - it appears on a map of local authority areas as a protuberance from the City's otherwise mid-Thames boundary. Why???
Tuesday 13 July 2004 11.08am
Blackfriars Railway Bridge is half and half so we always get consulted in the City for works to be carried out. London Bridge and Blackfriars Bridge and both City bridges.

Edited 1 times. Last edit at 13 July 2004 11.10am by James Hatts.
Tuesday 13 July 2004 11.40am
isn't southwark bridge owned by the city past the half way mark too?

[edited to say I can't remember where they put the Gryphons]

Edited 1 times. Last edit at 13 July 2004 11.40am by red bus.
Tuesday 13 July 2004 12.23pm
A pedant writes:

The heraldic supporters of the city arms are dragons. For some reason they are described as griffins (not gryphons) in the statutory list of historic buildings and Pevsner's Buildings of England, and therefore get described as such in guidebooks that haven't been researched on foot.

Griffins (or gryphons) ,as any fule nos, have the head and wings of an eagle and the body of a lion.

see note on Street Furniture at this site

Edited 1 times. Last edit at 13 July 2004 3.06pm by Lang Rabbie.
Tuesday 13 July 2004 1.05pm

i stand corrected !

still not sure about the bridge though - half way or all the way do ya know.?
Tuesday 13 July 2004 1.10pm
no it definitely goes all the way. I went over it this morning.
Saturday 17 July 2004 10.00am
The more I think about it the more annoyed I am

The Borough Market side of green dragon court is the important location
With its own special atmosphere

Not the high street side (which no one looks at)

They've got a cheek presenting a visualization that doesn't show what the Borough Market side will be like

There trying to get away with pushing the scheme through without showing the impact on the market side
Saturday 17 July 2004 12.22pm
I was unimpressed by the stuff on show in the trailer at Green Dragon Court on Thursday.

For starters I don't think it was acceptable that the handout comparison plans showed the "before" at pavement level, and the "after" at roof level !!!

I'm fairly sure that the photomontage of the proposed buiding on the corner of London Bridge Street and Borough High Street does not tally with the building line on the plans. IMO it's a really stupid building, which neither respects the former streetline nor would allow an improvement of the setting of the post office in the remaining Georgian wing of Old St Thomas' Hospital. I think it fails the test of enhancing the conservation area.

[The ground plan seems to be driven by traffic engineering for a junction widening as much as by the new viaduct. Will this actually be needed if the Shard of Glass happens?]

I agree with mickysalt that the lack of pictures from Green Dragon Court of the block at 16-26 Borough High Street was unhelpful. The other frontages of this block did at least seem to be better designed than some of the other proposals. However, if the new building continues in red brick all the way around, would the area under the new viaduct be too dark? Should they design the whole thing in london stock brick or a sympathetic material?

[Perhaps our Floral Hall portico "Committee of Taste" should reconvene in 2010 to decide how many layers of sootwash to apply.]

Finally, and heretically to some, if it is necessary to knock down part of the 1920s(?) block of shops at 2-4 Bedale Street, IMO the whole lot should be redeveloped by the Borough Market Trustees to a consistent and innovative design, rather than leaving one isolated bay at each end. Thameslink can't propose compulsory purchase for these, as they aren't needed for their scheme.

If the Thameslink scheme does go ahead, I hope that the Market sees it as an opportunity to improve communications between the western and eastern sections of the market, and provide something better than the narrow passage proposed in the current plans.
Monday 19 July 2004 11.40am
hmmm I feel

The Tooly street London bridge entrance is pretty hideous ,the blackfriyers railway shed across the bridge isn't very elegant and is going to be a real intrusion on the river.Blackfriers station is like nothing.

The Faringden entrance looks alright(Islington council are usually pretty good at making aesthetic decisions)

The Green Dragon court building should look as much like what is already there as possible

If it ant broke don't fix it

I Cant help feeling that had borough market been as well knowen when Thames link was conseved they wouldent have considerd the route through borough market

I dont agee about the comunication between one end to the other

Its the fact that you get a bit lost in there that people like about it.

Tuesday 17 August 2004 1.05pm
Going back to previous discussions we had on "WHO OWN WHICH BRIDGE"!!!!

The bridges across the River Thames are a vital part of London's transport infrastructure. The Corporation owns and maintains four road bridges which require sustained and expert maintenance to ensure they are fit for their job as gateways to the City. Since the day of its re-opening in February 2002, the Corporation has also taken over full responsibiltiy for the Millennium footbridge.

Tower Bridge This famous landmark bridge has a weight limit of 17 tonnes. Today some 40,000 vehicles cross Tower Bridge every day and it opens for river traffic about 500 times a year. For bridge opening times tel 020 7940 3984.
Visit the Tower Bridge Exhibition site .

Blackfriars Bridge remains the busiest of the four, with an average of 54,000 vehicles passing over it each day. Again there is no weight limit.

Southwark Bridge is used by around 17,000 vehicles each day and there is no weight limit.

London Bridge The current London Bridge was built in the early 1970's. There is no weight limit on the bridge itself, although there is a 17 tonne limit on the Monument pedestrian subway. An average of 38,000 vehicles use this bridge every day.

Click here for the history of these bridges .

Millennium Bridge
The first new pedestrian bridge to be built across the Thames for over a century, the Millennium footbridge links the City with Bankside. Ownership of, and responsibiltiy for the bridge was transferred to the Corporation of London in February 2002, when the bridge re-opened following successful remedial work to remove its 'wobble' . Open thoughout the year, it provides an invaluable link between communities north and south of the river. For more about the Millennium Bridge, visit the Arup website .

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