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The extension of 20mph speed limits to cover most of the borough

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Anonymous User
Thursday 16 September 2004 9.48am
grilf wrote:
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> "speed is not the cause of the majority of
> accidents, dangerous driving is"
>
> is this your opinion or do you have a source?


Sadly I cannot find it on the internet. Some time ago on a motoring website there was an open letter bemoaning the inappropriate use of speed cameras from a fairly senior member of the UK police force (who had understandably chosen to remain anonymous) this was one of the facts which he quoted.

If I manage to find it I will post the link.

I don't want to make myself sound like some kind of speed freak - I consider myself to be a very safe driver and I have a perfectly clean licence. I always abide by speed limits. I'm just incensed at the money making use of cameras and the (what feel like) attempts to replace personal responsibility with legislation.
Thursday 16 September 2004 9.53am
http://www.safespeed.org.uk/pr132.html

(I'm just providing the information - not saying whether or not I agree with it.)
Thursday 16 September 2004 10.07am
The Lady Miss Jo Jo wrote:
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> http://www.safespeed.org.uk/pr132.html
>
> (I'm just providing the information - not saying
> whether or not I agree with it.)

Surely too disingenuous. The info on that website is a million miles away from fact. They've basically tracked accident levels and also tracked number of speed cameras, and then attributed all changes in accident levels to changes in levels of speed cameras.

i.e. they are not admitting that anything else apart from installing speed cameras has any affect on road safety.

Straight from the Daily Mail school of linking facts to create irrefutable evidence.




...if you press it, they will come.
Thursday 16 September 2004 10.42am
Smoking is less dangerous than crossing the road.

(Tests carried out at Junction 4 of the M25)
Thursday 16 September 2004 2.03pm
I think 20 mph is reasonable giving the amount of traffic lights/ zebra crossings / speed bumps/ in Southwark - there seems to be enough incidents/near misses in Great Dover Street.

Any attempt to try to improve road safety for pedestrians/cyclists has got my vote.

If anyone saw a Granny look alike from the Express ( long black skirt/jacket ) waving her walking stick at a Richard Bonce behind a steering wheel in Tabard Street...it woz me....he came so close I almost lorst me 'andbag ( and me toes ) he was going about fortyfive......
Thursday 16 September 2004 7.47pm
Jan the old one wrote:
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> I think 20 mph is reasonable giving the amount of
> traffic lights/ zebra crossings / speed bumps/ in
> Southwark - there seems to be enough
> incidents/near misses in Great Dover Street.
>
> Any attempt to try to improve road safety for
> pedestrians/cyclists has got my vote.
>
Very sorry to hear of your near miss. My point is that no matter what the limit is some idiots will abuse it. That does not mean we need lower limits, it means we need better drivers! The rest of us have a responsibility to be vigilant too. We are always going to be surrounded by idiots so the sensible amongst us look out for them at all times. Jan you are clearly one of these otherwise you would have been squashed.
Life is always full of risks, we should minimise them obviously, but we cannot stop them completely. If we did we would have a hugely boring existence wrapped in cottonwool. Bikes would be banned, cars would be banned. letting children walk anywhere unaccompanied would be banned. What kind of life would that be? I drive a car,a scooter,I cycle and I am a pedestrian. I use whichever method of transport is most appropriate. I consider myself a safe driver and riding a motorcycle has taught me to drive defensively, as has cycling. I enjoy driving and the idea that draconian speed limits to appease Daily Mail or Guardian readers (I think that covers my prejudices :) ) is too much Nanny State for me.
As for Great Dover Street, don't get me started on the TFL planners who have caused the dangers here!
Friday 17 September 2004 8.38am
Yes, very nice, but what would you propose as a solution???

...if you press it, they will come.
Friday 17 September 2004 10.53am

Jerry for every responsible safe driver like your self, on the streets of Southwark there are probably 50 who can not drive, 50 who are not insured / taxed etc.

As I have limited mobility I am extremely careful when on the streets/ roads/ pubs.....sorry in pubs!

Do the elderly pedestrians or children always concentrate crossing the road?

The traffic last night was crawling along at about 15mph.

I too love driving but have to concede that I am a lousy driver and not safe to be on the road, pity more people did not think like that.....

Does driving at 20mph really drive that many people crazy?

Friday 17 September 2004 1.07pm
Not sure that being able to cross the road safely constitutes 'a hugely boring existence wrapped in cottonwool'.

gggggrrrrrruuff
Friday 17 September 2004 1.50pm
hot puppy wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not sure that being able to cross the road safely
> constitutes 'a hugely boring existence wrapped in
> cottonwool'.
>
> gggggrrrrrruuff

The only method of guaranteeing a safe road crossing is by building bridges or digging tunnels, and limiting them to pedestrians only, banning bikes on them, forbidding running (so no children either) and having daily, no hourly, maintenance checks. See my point now? All I'm saying is life has to be a compromise between safety laws and individual responsilbility, or it becomes too "George Orwellian", and I believe the present speed limits are often mis-applied let alone introducing more stringent ones.
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