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Tuesday 6 January 2004 8.23am
Anyone hear the Tory/pro-road lobby on the news last night/this morning, complaining about Govt plans to actually enforce traffic laws by using wardens?

There were so many variations on the theme of "I'm special....I'm different....it's only a little bending of the rules....not really breaking them...etc", that I thought I was back on this thread!!



...there's plenty more c**** in the cup.
Tuesday 6 January 2004 10.09am
On one level you are entitled to prance around on your moral high ground, but........

- is this increased enforcement due to concern about people breaking the law, or to make more money. If the latter it is a blunt instrument that hits ordinary working people such as the elusive plumber far harder than it hits the city banker.

- living in London is tough enough. Stuff happens. You put plenty of extra in the meter but every so often you get delayed by three miniutes only to see the warden disappear on his moped and a ticket on your screen. Or you cut through 5 feet of bus lane to turn left and get hit by a camera.

No excuses for breaking the law, but please accept the real frustration that increasingly strict enforcement brings.

Every so often figures are published about the low collection rates on things like parking fines, congestion charge and all. It looks like most of the extra revenue is being collected from normally 'law abiding' people, whilst the unisured, untaxed evader who poses the much greater danger continues to get away with it.

I suspect the first outcome of the new Government policy will be even more Channel 4 programmes about No Going Back or A Place in the Sun. We can but dream.
Tuesday 6 January 2004 11.02am
With all due respect Sarah, re your first point, I suspect it may hit the banker more than the plumber, especially if the plumber does £all out work.

.......tightening up the pipe

Jai
Tuesday 6 January 2004 12.07pm
yes... remember seeing a program on tv, about lawyers and Investment Bankers looking to change careers and becoming plumbers. big shortage apparently...

I'm in agreement of Sarah however, that this kind of "taxation" hits the lower earners harder.



Varkenslachter
Tuesday 6 January 2004 12.11pm
Sarah,

Thanks for the name calling. Hope you don't mind if I go on "prancing" a bit (although I'll try to keep my side of this polite and uninsulting. It might work as a nice contrast).

I can understand that you get frustrated. That's natural. However, both your comments and those of mappy above share the same main theme: "Yes, I was breaking the law, but.......[cue list of special circumstances that puts you above the law]".

It's annoying to get, for instance, bus lane tickets for "nipping in" for a few yards. I know, I got snapped recently and hit for £50.

Unfortunately, just because it annoys me it doesn't mean I can ignore the law. I knew it was a bus lane when I took the gamble to go in it. And I don't think it'd be reasonable of me to go round soliciting people's sympathy just because I'd been caught doing something illegal of my own free will.

Just stop for a second and think what other sorts of laws you'd advocate people ignoring. Is it OK to go a few miles over the speed limit in a built up area, based on your personal judgement of an appropriate speed (rather than the law)? Can hard-line Marxists get of theft charges based on the ideology that, since all property is theft, no one owns anything anyway? By now I suspect you'll be fuming and thinking I'm taking the piss, but there's consistent logic here.

If you really object to parking restrictions/bus lanes/whatever, then the only answer is to get the law changed. In the meantime, though, one really should just pay up and keep quiet.



...there's plenty more c**** in the cup.
Tuesday 6 January 2004 12.33pm
Ivanhoe: Racism '(a) a belief in the uperiority of a particular race; prejudice based on this. (b) antagonism towards, or discrimination against, other races, esp. as a result of this.'

I made an observation that the standard of English spoken by the staff in the parking shop is less than adequate. You called me a racist. I presume you imagine (correctly) that I am Caucasian. You have therefore jumped to the conclusion that the staff are not Caucasian. Where did you find this piece of 'evidence'? I consider that a bare minimum for somebody to do a job is being able to communicate! French, Cornish, German, Welsh, Jamaican or Estuary, it really makes no difference what the native language is if their English is incomprehensible, whichever of the 6 great kingdoms, principalities, colonies or republics the individual may hail from.
Tuesday 6 January 2004 12.42pm
Carpmaker reminds me of Adele.
Tuesday 6 January 2004 1.16pm
Except that Adele had - in comparison - an engaging naivety which is completely missing from Ivanhoe/Carpmaker's posts. Poor fellow - somebody's done something very nasty to him recently; maybe we should club together for some counselling for him. I think Lang Rabbie may have hit the nail on the head (see chatter).

Also, Adele went away quite rapidly!
Tuesday 6 January 2004 1.20pm
I don't see anything wrong with Carpmaker's posts.

The fact that you have all got so worked up rather goes to prove his point.
Tuesday 6 January 2004 1.46pm
And I think you're all being rather rude.

There's a big difference between what I'm saying and Adele's behaviour.

IMO, the only thing I've done is not run away at the first sign of bullying and blustering from ampmaker. Very sorry about that, I'm sure.

TLMJJ. If we're onto personal comments, then you used to remind me of a measured and open-minded poster. You now remind me of my manners (in that I'll not resort to swapping names).

Now is anyone interested in debating the original topic?



...there's plenty more c**** in the cup.
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